Celebrating the Timeless Legacy of Joni Mitchell through Music and Memories Joni Mitchell recently made a comeback with a series of shows at the Gorge in Washington, Judy Mishkin and Alex Greenberg join Larry Mishkin to talk about this "event of the century" Brandi Carlile, a popular musician, played a key role in bringing Joni back to the stage after more than 20 years. The shows featured a lineup of talented performers, including Annie Lennox, Sarah McLachlan, and Lucius, creating a memorable experience for the audience. Joni's voice has evolved with age, singing in a lower register, but still maintaining its power and resonance. The performances were described as a love fest and a celebration of women in music. Produced by PodConx Deadhead Cannabis Show - https://podconx.com/podcasts/deadhead-cannabis-show Larry Mishkin - https://podconx.com/guests/larry-mishkin Jay Blakesberg - https://podconx.com/guests/jay-blakesberg Recorded on Squadcast
Celebrating the Timeless Legacy of Joni Mitchell through Music and Memories
Joni Mitchell recently made a comeback with a series of shows at the Gorge in Washington, Judy Mishkin and Alex Greenberg join Larry Mishkin to talk about this "event of the century" Brandi Carlile, a popular musician, played a key role in bringing Joni back to the stage after more than 20 years. The shows featured a lineup of talented performers, including Annie Lennox, Sarah McLachlan, and Lucius, creating a memorable experience for the audience. Joni's voice has evolved with age, singing in a lower register, but still maintaining its power and resonance. The performances were described as a love fest and a celebration of women in music.
Deadhead Cannabis Show - https://podconx.com/podcasts/deadhead-cannabis-show
Larry Mishkin - https://podconx.com/guests/larry-mishkin
Jay Blakesberg - https://podconx.com/guests/jay-blakesberg
Larry:
Hello everyone and welcome to another episode of the Deadhead Cannabis Show. I'm Larry Mishkin of Mishkin Law in Chicago and we've got a great show today. We've got a really good Grateful Dead show that we're going to feature from 1976 and we have some special guests who are going to give us a first-hand report from the recent Joni Jam out at the Gorge in George Washington. But first let's dive into Grateful Dead, June 26, 1976 from Sweet Home Chicago in the Auditorium So we just featured Sugaree two weeks ago from the June 12th, 1988 show at the Knickerbocker Arena in Almaty. But this version is 12 years earlier and is widely considered to be one of the top Sugarees of 1976. Well into their first full year back of touring, Jerry's voice is clear and sharp, the music is right on, there can never be too many Sugarees, so we may feature it a lot more in the future and everyone should enjoy it and this is a great, great version. The auditorium theater is kind of a special place in Chicago. It really is a, you know, what I would call an adult music venue, right? Where they have a ballet and they have shows and they have stuff like that. Um, but it is, it's a music performance venue. It's located in the auditorium building, which is part of Roosevelt university in Chicago, right downtown on Michigan avenue. And, uh, it's, uh, it's a beautiful old, uh, Renaissance type building. And they've had amazing shows there over the years. There was a period of time. uh... when uh... the building was in bad repair and uh... the show stopped but uh... beginning in the late sixties through today it's really been built up and one of the mainstays of the auditorium theater has been the incredible streak of rock and roll performers that have come through there including diana ross genesis david gilmore jimmy hendricks the who janis joplin bruce springsteen uh... for those of you who are Crosby Stills and Ashen Young fans on july fifth nineteen seventy they performed at the venue and a big part of that went on their double live album Four Way Street. Genesis performed there, they did the Lamb Days down on Broadway tour and of course in the midst of all of this we have the Grateful Dead who played at the auditorium theater nineteen times in the early to mid 1970s, a little before my time but uh... shows that I've heard and listened to and I have friends who have made it to some of them and it's always a great place. uh... further played us some shows there in march of twenty ten uh... which was the first and last time uh... after the seventies that anybody from the grateful dead uh... ventured back there and phil and bobby apparently uh... loving the venue just a little too much did go and play a show there uh... two shows and in my opinion they were some of the best for the shows ever played uh... the auditorium theater is fun cause you walk in and it really screams out to anyone who walks in this is a And we had warned my son who was going with us to the show that this is not your standard Grateful Dead venue where people start smoking. And of course, as the lights went out, all the smoking started. Just goes to show that even in a venue like that, they understand what the dead like to do and their fans like to do. So that was all really, really good stuff. And the auditorium theater is a great place. And continuing on with the show, Dan, let's go ahead and play the second clip. Peggy O is a traditional ballad arranged and played regularly by Garcia and the Dead from the early 1970s all the way through to the end. They first performed it in 1973 and actually played it right up until one of the final shows in St. Louis before they came up to a soldier field for the final shows. Peggy O is one of those songs that... You know, when you hear it originally, it's kind of an interesting song. It's a little bit of a different style than what we're used to the dead playing. But it's one of those tunes that, you know, once you know the story and once you know the words and you follow along, it's really a lot of fun. And what's really nice about these mid to late 1970s shows is that a number of these tunes are now getting broken out, right? We've moved up beyond Americana dead and the dead are starting to pick up all sorts of different things. but stay true to their roots and Peggy O is just one of these great tunes that fits right in and in 1976 as you can hear Jerry's guitar playing is immaculate, his voice is really solid much better than some of the Jerry voices we got much later on for those of us that were a little bit later in jumping on the bus in terms of where the dead were and how they were performing but Peggy O is always a fun tune and at this show they really go and they really jam it out. Okay. I said we have a couple of guests today and we do. We have with us my wife Judy and a friend of the show and an original guest, Andy Greenberg from San Francisco sitting in. And I've asked them to join us today because there's been a lot in the news lately about Joni Mitchell having made a comeback. And thanks to her good friend and performer Brandy Carlisle who's one of the hottest things going in the music business today. And she has befriended Joni and they... They put together this series of shows that were out at the Gorge in George Washington. I always get a kick out of that, George Washington. And it was really amazing. Joni hadn't performed live or headlined a show in 20 plus years. In fact, Judy and I saw Joni and Bob Dylan do a show at the United Center, I want to say, in like 1988 or 89. And that may have been her last tour before this recent. go around and what brandy did here is great cuz brandy's kind of at the peak of her popularity and notwithstanding that she's really reached out to uh... a woman who's a legend in rock and roll and as you'll hear from some interviews we have uh... of other people talking about her in a few minutes so highly thought of by everyone in rock and roll across the board uh... as not just being a good person but being an amazing performer and uh... somebody who could be collaborated with and uh... and really put it all together rather than have me try to explain about
Andy:
Thank you.
Larry:
this amazing experience, I thought it would be great to bring in a couple of people who are actually there and can give us first-hand reviews. So, Judy, welcome to the show. This is your first time on my podcast, but it's nice to have you.
Judy Teibloom-Mishkin:
Thanks honey, I hear you taping it often, but I've never been on it. I'm thrilled to be here.
Larry:
Well, you know, finally you're the most important person in the room when it comes to music in this family, because you saw the show of the year, so
Judy Teibloom-Mishkin:
century.
Larry:
of the century even better. And of course, Andy Greenberg, so nice to have you back on our show again. Andy, how are you?
Andy:
I'm doing great. Thank you for having me again. Happy to be
Larry:
Well,
Andy:
here.
Larry:
thank you for taking the time. So guys, you just came back from a life-changing type of show. You got to hear absolutely amazing music. Judy, give us a quick intro as to how this all came about and what motivated you guys to go.
Judy Teibloom-Mishkin:
Okay, so my friend Amy Schuman loves Brandi Carlile, turned me on to her. And so for her birthday last summer, I took her to see Brandi at Northerly Island and I was blown away. She's an incredible performer. She's just, she is absolutely fantastic. Then a couple, maybe a month later, I'm not sure, but later that summer when we were with Andy in Boulder was when Joni surprised the world and performed. at the folk festival and we shared that experience and it was extremely moving to watch her like the arc of life. I saw her in 1983, so here we are almost 20 years later, well now it's 40, I mean sorry, 40 years later and she's performing on the other side of a catastrophic medical situation with a huge rehab. So after that, I thought that was it, but then shortly after the Brandi announced she was playing at the Gorge and I was just determined to get tickets. I did everything I could. I joined the Brandi Carlisle fan club. I tried every venue and place under the sun. And then randomly or not, because it was meant to be that we went, I went online one night and got, and lo and behold, there were tickets. So I snatched four and off we went. The plans, we started the plans.
Larry:
Okay, and Andy, I'm sure you were very hard to convince to join this group and go see Joni.
Andy:
Yeah, it took about less than a second for me to say yes to this. It was amazing. I was so happy to be invited and had been looking forward to it for so long. Judy was amazing getting these tickets.
Larry:
That's great. You know, you guys have known each other forever as well. We all seem to know each other forever. And you know, it's great to move through life and be able to join us. Judy, you mentioned 1983. Tell us about that a little bit. You saw Joanie in Paris, didn't you?
Judy Teibloom-Mishkin:
I did in a theater on the Champs de Lize. She opened with Freeman in Paris. It was incredible. That was a much younger Joni.
Larry:
Sure.
Judy Teibloom-Mishkin:
It was awesome. It was just great. I was with Deeney. We were traveling in Europe and
Larry:
Mm-hmm.
Judy Teibloom-Mishkin:
woke up my cousins at night when we got home late. It was great. It was a very cool experience.
Larry:
You touched on it a little bit. I mean, that was Joni when maybe not quite at her peak, but certainly still on the high side of things in terms of where she was at physically and mentally and emotionally and performing. And when I think of a Joni Mitchell concert, I think of a, I'm sure she could sell out huge stadiums, but I always liked to think of her playing in a smaller venue in a town like Paris, bringing in those people who really know Joni and appreciate her. for the musical talent that she brings to the table. So that's very cool that you had the perspective of earlier Joanie, you know, to be able to compare that against today. So let's ask, obviously she's a little bit older and doesn't move as well as she did back then, but you know, what would you say about her voice? Do you think her voice was still sounding as strong and as rich or was there a little bit of age to it?
Judy Teibloom-Mishkin:
She sings in a lower register now, which is extremely sultry and powerful. It's very rich. Andy, what are your thoughts on that?
Andy:
Yeah, I was going to say, Larry, when you said you saw her at a higher point, I was going to say her voice was also much higher back then. She was obviously she had that classic soprano sound to it. You could never mistake her a Joni song when it came on the radio. And now it is much it's about two registers lower, but it's still so resonant and powerful. And she still even has the vibrato. in that lower register. So it's unmistakably Joni and having her surrounded on stage with a lot of people who can carry the higher parts, they do not miss it. I mean, but she was still the anchor of every song.
Larry:
What's interesting you say that let's go back a minute because it was a series of shows over the weekend Friday Saturday and Sunday the Joni Jam was on Saturday night. And he told us a little bit about Friday night with brandy and Joni and all these women who started walking out on the stage.
Andy:
Friday night was really incredible. We all said afterwards that Friday night was a love fest between Randy Carlisle, all of her guests and the audience. And you could really feel the energy flowing between what was happening on the stage and what was happening in the audience. I mean, I think everyone, and Judy will probably confirm this, but everybody in the audience felt like they were just part of the same. show as what was happening on the stage. And every time somebody new came out, it was felt deeply in the audience.
Larry:
and who were some of these performers.
Andy:
It was Lucius. There's an amazing guitar player named Solis. Marcus Mumford was out and he was one of the openers on Friday and then he also basically sat in as her percussion guy the whole weekend. Annie Lennox came out, Sarah McLaughlin, a woman named Brandy Clark who's currently on Broadway in a play called Shucked and Who am I missing, Judy?
Judy Teibloom-Mishkin:
Well, Alison Russell was one of the openers as well. She was great.
Larry:
Okay.
Judy Teibloom-Mishkin:
What was so moving about it or so powerful is that Brandi is really a community organizer. There's just no doubt about it. She's all about giving other artists a foot up and she gives so much support and love and it returns to her. It's just, it's so reciprocal and there's so much energy and love and good feeling. between her and the audience and between her and the other musicians. It's very authentic.
Larry:
Well, I would say so. I mean, you know, the list of names you just read, I mean, this is like a powerhouse of women performers. I mean, you know, there's, there's not a name on there, uh, you know, where you have to scratch your head too hard. I mean, uh, Annie Lennox is Annie Lennox. And I think that she had an appropriate introduction for her. Did she not Judy?
Judy Teibloom-Mishkin:
Annie fucking Lennox.
Larry:
Well, you know, we were lucky enough to see Ante Lettix in the Eurythmics again, you know, probably back in the 1980s. Um, and at the time, you know, she, to me was, you know, just, you know, the epitome of, of the strong, you know, musical performer with her booming voice. And, you know, she just commanded a room like nobody else. What's she like today?
Andy:
She is, she's still very commanding and she, her voice is stellar. Her voice is incredible. The first night she just did, I think, one song. It was Why. And I'd been holding it together pretty well until that point and then that's when I lost it. She,
Larry:
Hehehehe
Andy:
it was just so beautiful. And everybody on stage, you could just see how, how reverent everybody was about. especially the women who came out and had been, you know, in the business for decades now, commanded so much respect from the younger ones. And I agree with what Judy said, Brandy is like the catalyst that I think she respects the people who came before her and sees herself as a pathway for those who are up and coming. And to have them all on the stage at the same time was really magical.
Larry:
Well, and I see the name Sarah McLaughlin on there, and I've always loved her, and I've loved her performances. But my impression was she had kind of fallen out of the scene for a little while. Is that accurate, Judy?
Judy Teibloom-Mishkin:
Yeah, she has not been performing much. And she of course was the organizer of the Lilith fairs, which were at the Gorge and Brandi Carlisle attended them. And that was one of the models of inspiration for her. And it was extremely moving to have her back and her voice is incredible. And jumping forward the next night she performed blue and very few people could pull that off. I mean, it was unbelievable.
Andy:
Agreed.
Larry:
Yeah, you know, when I saw her name, I just thought that was fantastic. And that's kind of cool too, because Brandy's from that part of the world, as I recall. And so she actually grew up listening to a lot of these women perform. Is that right, Andy?
Andy:
That is right. And she made a point of saying that over and over. She told a lot of stories both days that we were there. We did not attend on the high women day, but on both days she really peppered her banter in between songs with stories of growing up there and all the people that she saw. And actually when she introduced Sarah McLoughlin, I don't remember what song it was, but she talked about going to the Lilith Fair on the Friday show, and she said we're going to do one of Sarah's songs, and when she opened her mouth to sing, Sarah's voice came out, and Sarah walked out from the side of the stage,
Larry:
Oh
Andy:
and
Larry:
wow.
Andy:
everybody went crazy. It was really cool. It was a good
Larry:
So
Andy:
way
Larry:
she's
Andy:
to
Larry:
a little
Andy:
introduce...
Larry:
bit of a showman too. She knows how to play the crowd and not just, not just do it, build up the suspense and everything. That's fantastic.
Andy:
Yeah.
Larry:
Judy, tell me a little bit about Lucius, cause I know that that, who comprises that? Cause they play with Brandy Karloff quite a bit, don't they?
Judy Teibloom-Mishkin:
Yes, but I'm going to defer to Andy on that. You're more of an expert. It's two women, but remind me they're Jess and
Andy:
Holly.
Judy Teibloom-Mishkin:
Holly.
Larry:
And they perform as a separate unit. And I'm like, do they have their own shows and their own tours?
Andy:
They do, they do have their own shows and their own tours. They recently played a bread and roses benefit, which as you know, my husband Alex is on the advisory board.
Larry:
Sure.
Andy:
And so they do a lot of, they do a lot of benefits around the Bay Area. and they, we were able to see them in a converted church that's now a music venue, with Solis actually, and they were so, their harmonies are so tight, they've been playing together since college, they, you can't really differentiate one from the other, they're so in sync that it's kind of uncanny, like I don't think I've ever seen any group. or duo or anything that is as in sync as Lucius is and their voices are beautiful.
Judy Teibloom-Mishkin:
We have
Larry:
And
Judy Teibloom-Mishkin:
tickets
Larry:
dessert.
Judy Teibloom-Mishkin:
to see them, Ler. We actually have tickets to see them on July 27th with DOS
Larry:
Oh, wonderful.
Judy Teibloom-Mishkin:
at Space Outside.
Andy:
Oh, I
Larry:
Well
Andy:
forgot
Larry:
good then
Andy:
about
Larry:
I'll-
Andy:
Daws. Because...
Larry:
I'll be able to come back and report on my own experiences with them then. Wonderful. See, it helps
Andy:
You will.
Larry:
to, you know, to be married to a woman who's very tuned into rock and roll because you get to see good shows even when you don't know that they're coming along. So score big on that one. Um, is there a story behind how Lucius came to start playing with a brandy?
Judy Teibloom-Mishkin:
My understanding is they had moved from New York to LA, and they were part of the Joni Jams. I don't know the order in which people joined the Joni Jams, but Brandy was not the first. I think Brandy is certainly the catalyst, but my understanding, you know, I'm not sure who was what the genesis of it is, but I know that they were part of the Jams because they live in LA. And many of the people who played at the show we saw have been part of those Jams years.
Larry:
And Solis, I have to confess that I really didn't know very much about Solis. I'd heard the name bandied about. And, uh, after the shows, Judy was so impressed that she sat me down and showed me some clips of Solis and I was blown away. Um, this is a woman who jams a guitar, like very few people jam a guitar. Uh, the clips I saw, she's shredding. She, and I'm going to tell you, she reminds me a little bit of Brittany Howard. from Alabama Shakes, right? She's somebody who when you first look at them, you don't necessarily get that rock and roll vibe, but then you put a guitar in their hands and watch out. I mean, she just, she lights it up. So Andy, how was she like at the show?
Andy:
She was really, really incredible. And on the Saturday show, they really featured her a lot more than on Friday and let her cut loose. And she was the key element of the song, Help Me. It was, I don't think people could even talk. during the beginning of that. You didn't even know what song it was and it was slow and sultry and her guitar playing was sort of a combo of Jimi Hendrix and Prince but with her own spin on it and it was it was really amazing.
Larry:
It sounds great, you know, and I love hearing that because, you know, we need, we always need new rock and roll guitarists. And quite frankly, I think it's better for the industry. I think it's better for everybody when we have women and we have people of color and who are stepping in and filling these roles. It takes this music and it really expands it out just behind, beyond, let's say, you know, what we typically think of as like the common, you know, grateful dead type. musicians or crowds or standard rock and roll and I think it just makes it so much more accessible to everyone when you can identify with the performers. You know that's a great, great thing. Does Solis sing? Good voice.
Andy:
Yes.
Judy Teibloom-Mishkin:
us.
Andy:
Yes, really good voice.
Larry:
So she's the whole package. Unbelievable. Judy, are you going to tell me that we have tickets to see Solis too?
Judy Teibloom-Mishkin:
Well, it's actually rumored that she's gonna be at that Lucius and Doss show.
Larry:
OK, well,
Judy Teibloom-Mishkin:
So
Larry:
there
Judy Teibloom-Mishkin:
I'm really
Larry:
you go.
Judy Teibloom-Mishkin:
hoping.
Larry:
There you go. So the way this is going, you could show up for one of these shows and have no idea who else might wander out on stage with you. So that's pretty exciting as well. And I love the fact that Marcus Mumford was there. Was he one of the few men who populated the stage over the weekend?
Judy Teibloom-Mishkin:
there were several men and Andy helped me out but there was the guy
Andy:
Taylor,
Judy Teibloom-Mishkin:
from Dawes,
Andy:
yeah, Taylor Goldsmith.
Judy Teibloom-Mishkin:
Taylor Goldsmith and there was a man, I can't think of his name right now but Mumford just released a solo album with this other guy. There was several men in Brandy's band, there's the I didn't do my homework properly. The guitar player who sang that song with Joni, his own original work, who has been .. Joni, I'm sorry.
Andy:
Right.
Judy Teibloom-Mishkin:
part of her musical life for decades and decades and she he played.
Larry:
Mm-hmm.
Judy Teibloom-Mishkin:
There were some horn players that were men. One of the strings players was a man also. There was a whole string section.
Andy:
Oh yeah, they were amazing.
Larry:
Okay. And, and I think that I read somewhere and you may have mentioned to me, uh, that one of the musicians who played with them was Brandy's wife, who came out on stage and played a few songs.
Andy:
That's correct on Saturday.
Larry:
So this is like, she's got like a whole musical family. That's fantastic that she and her spouse are both not just musically inclined, but talented enough to be able to perform like that.
Judy Teibloom-Mishkin:
Her wife has a beautiful voice. They did an acoustic set to open Saturday night and they did a few songs together.
Larry:
And just because I've heard this story a bunch of times, I think it's a good one to share. But Judy, I know you have a very funny story about Brandy and her wife and their kids traveling and meeting up with Sir Elton John.
Judy Teibloom-Mishkin:
At the Brandy Show last summer with Amy, she told a story about, they were invited to be guests at Elton John's and they got there, I don't know, early in the morning, slept a few hours and came down for breakfast, very formally set table. He's, you know, he's fancy. And he said, you know, order what would you like for breakfast? And one of her children promptly opened her mouth and vomited it all over the table, the gorgeous table of China. And she said he was appalled. But his partner was very gracious about it.
Larry:
So Brandy is just going to go down in history as being like the Forrest Gump of music, right? She's everywhere with everybody and everything is happening to her. To me, the most amazing part of that story isn't that the kid puked, we all have little kids and we know that happens. It's that she and her wife were invited to stay at Elton John's house in the first place to achieve that type of fame and not just that, but the connection she made I think just speaks. very loudly, uh, to the type of person she is. So, you know, my senses with all of this, uh, going on, on Friday night, that it was for a minute there. It may have even been possible to forget that you guys were really out there to see Joni the next day. This, this Friday night show was so amazing. And so what you go back to your Airbnb Friday night and you're saying, well, how can they top that?
Judy Teibloom-Mishkin:
it was one of the best concerts i've ever seen the friday night show uh...
Andy:
Yeah,
Larry:
So, so
Andy:
we all said
Larry:
Brandi,
Andy:
that.
Larry:
she really set the bar high for Saturday night. But then as I've been told and certainly read about, she came out and they hit a home run Saturday night as well. So, so let's talk about how Saturday night played out. Um, you know, everything from, I, you know, the, the pictures I've seen, they, they set the stage up like a living room. They had couches and chairs and, you know, more of like people just gathering together to play music, is that right?
Judy Teibloom-Mishkin:
Yeah, they recreated the Joni Jam and everybody, Brandy introduced every musician, they all took their seats and then Joni came out. The anticipation, the energy was unbelievable. And even though Friday night was incredible, we knew that Saturday night was going to be something other than anything we had ever seen in our lives. It really was beyond a musical performance. It was a bit of a spiritual experience. I hope I don't sound crazy. But I've been, my statement has been, I have been to the mountaintop. I mean, I really.
Larry:
Okay, so you guys are there. There's some performance going on and they say, okay, now it's time for Joanie and she comes out. Andy, what are you thinking at this point?
Andy:
Well, honestly, Larry, I was, like, again, unable to talk a lot of the time. I mean, It was so, like Judy said, it was so spiritual and we were seriously worshiping at the church of Joni. And we would turn to each other in the middle of a song and nobody could talk. We were just, everybody was just sort of communicating, like, are you seeing this? Are you hearing this? It was so special. We were so lucky to be there. I think every single... person of the 27,000 who were there was feeling the exact same way. People were respectful, people were nice to each other. And, you know, after Joni and her wife did the opening set, we couldn't even leave our seats. We were, I mean, even I think if people wanted to go to the bathroom and get something to drink, it didn't matter. Nobody left. Nobody wanted to miss one single second. And then when Joni appeared on stage, the crowd went wild. and it was so loud for about five minutes, and then it was silent, reverently silent. Everybody wanted to hear every single second of what she had to say and sing. It was really like nothing I've ever experienced.
Larry:
So was it all music or did Brandy take some time to talk to Joni and get some stories out of her?
Judy Teibloom-Mishkin:
There was a lot of talk. There were a lot of stories woven and you could see Joni warming up more and more and telling more and more stories as the night went on. And as Brandy explained, she said at the Joni Jams, we sing with Joni, we sing to Joni, we sing for Joni. So there was like this rotation in place. So for example, when Annie Lennox sang her song to Joni, Ladies of the Canyon, she sat beside her in the seat, with Brandy, the two main seats were Brandy and Joni. But she... came and sat in her seat and told Joni how much she meant to her. It was extremely moving how when she heard her for one of the albums, she was so poor she couldn't afford a record album but her roommate had bought the record and how much it struck her that she could be a musician too. There were so few women at the time. How inspiring it had been for her was extremely moving. So there were a lot of stories and Joni warmed up more and more. Both her voice got stronger and she started telling really funny and great stories.
Larry:
You know, that's wonderful because it's rare, I think, that people of Joanie's stature have a chance to be not just honored like this, but being honored like this at a time when, luckily enough, she's able to perform it. And my understanding is that as a result of the various health issues that she's had over the last few years, that she found herself in a position not unlike Jerry after his coma where she really had to kind of reteach herself. the guitar and all of that. And what's amazing to me when I hear these stories is, when Jerry Garcia says, well, I had to sit down and relearn the guitar. I mean, I'm sure that means different things to him than it does to us. And Joni, the same way I see it as the brain getting back to a point again where they're able to do the things they do. But knowing all, because at some point they pulled out a guitar and Joni played guitar too, right?
Andy:
she did.
Larry:
And, you know, one of the things I always loved about Joni and, and I think that, you know, was, you know, she didn't just write songs, you know, she didn't just write classic songs, you know, she wrote real, such real music that, you know, she performed herself and, uh, you know, I mean, this was back in the time when, yes, there was a lot of rock performers doing that. There was also a lot of rock performers on like, you know, not unlike the boy bands today who they all get together, somebody hands them music and words and they, they sit down and they belt it out. But, you know, uh, How did her guitar playing sound, Judy?
Judy Teibloom-Mishkin:
amazing that was at the very end. She curated the entire show. She chose all the songs. She picked three songs from her youth from the 50s. There was Love Potion Number Nine and Why Do Fools Fall in Love. She was all over the place, but she also wrote music in many different genres. She wrote in jazz. She was not afraid to take chances musically. Some of her later work from played a few songs, they were very powerful, beautiful songs, but when she came up for the encore with playing the guitar, that took it to another level.
Andy:
True.
Larry:
Now Joni was, now you were getting full blown Joni.
Andy:
By then, yes.
Larry:
Okay. That's the, you know, what a, uh, you know, it, I saw clips of it and everything, but, uh, you know, what a wonderful night and, you know, and what I love is how, uh, you know, Brandi is so focused on her. And, you know, I mean, look, let's not kid ourselves. Brandi Carlile is a huge rock star in her own right. And the fact that, you know, she's showering so much love and devotion on Joni, uh, is a wonderful thing. And for Joni, how amazing, right? To be here with this whole, stage full of women all inspired by her and you know and how she got to be in the position she is in. is that in fact that i have a clip here that i want to play uh... you know this is the deadhead cannabis show so uh... whenever we whenever we're talking about other musicians uh... i just instinctively go and look to see if i can find any instances because a lot of people have played with the grateful dead over the years and i certainly don't know that uh... joanie was part of the dead circle for a while back in the day they were all part of the same uh... group with cross be stills nash and young very heavily involved in uh... people who all stay together but I couldn't find an example of Joni on stage with the boys, I couldn't find an example of Jerry joining her in a concert, but I did find this. Dan, go ahead and roll this. Well, that certainly puts a whole new spin on me and my uncle, right Andy?
Andy:
That's incredible. What year was that from?
Larry:
I think 1965. Yeah, let's see, she was on the David Brant show called Let's Sing Out and I would encourage everyone, you can download this on YouTube and the voice and the singing are amazing, but you have to see her. She's young, she's this incredibly fresh-faced woman up there surrounded by a stage full of men who are all just sitting there watching her sing. and you can see her fingers flying on the guitar. And as she sings these verses where she kind of stops for a minute on the video, she like turns to the screen and winks and you know, really does all of this. When I saw that I was like, wow, right? I mean, this is a, we all think of me and my uncle as a Grateful Dead song. It was actually written by John Phillips from the Mamas and the Papas. It's been recorded by everybody. Judy Collins went big with it for a while. But most of us know it as a Grateful Dead tune. And not just a Grateful Dead tune, the Grateful Dead tune that according to the statistics was played more than any other Grateful Dead tune over the years. If you saw all the concerts that the Grateful Dead played, you would have heard me and my uncle about 620 or 30 times, which tops out and just coincidentally, by the way, some of that and playing in the band is the second. most sugar magnolia, I think is the third, and you have to go down to fourth or fifth before you get to Garcia and China cat. Uh, so those of us who, you know, always secretly believe that Bobby was getting a little too much time at the microphone. Well, now we know that's true. Um, and, and look, there were days when we'd go and we'd, we'd see dead shows and, and they would just, uh, you know, kill this on you. It would be great and we'd love it. And you know, there'd be other days when it would just be, you know, part of the cowboy duo that we would always get somewhere in the middle of the first set and you'd pay attention to it or not. But again, you know, you get somebody like Joni Mitchell, who goes after it, you know, it gives me all new respect for the song. Not unlike the way I felt when Fish played Boston's More Than a Feeling at the Donut Concerts back in Madison Square Garden. And all of a sudden this song with Trace singing it, man, that's a cool tune. Me and my uncle, wow. That's just amazing. So what do you guys think of that one?
Judy Teibloom-Mishkin:
That was incredible.
Andy:
It really was. Thank you for that. That was a real gift, hearing her
Larry:
Yeah,
Andy:
do that.
Larry:
it's fun, and it's important, I think, as we see people more in the sunset of their career to also go back and really kind of cherish those moments when it was all just beginning for them. And for Joanie, she certainly never had a shortage of boyfriends or things like that, but she really had a special relationship with some of the guys in Crosby, Stills, Nash and Young. being a Canadian, similarly spent a lot of time with her and David Crosby helped bring her to California and to the United States and they have some great stories too and in fact we have a couple of quick clips from the two of them talking about Joni. They've been celebrating Blue because it's been 15 years since you made it. I think that's arguably the best singer-songwriter record ever made. Much better than myself. But also special, like, do you stay in touch today at all? Like, did you call her? I called her the other day. On the flip phone? Uh, I might not have been on the flip phone. But I might have been, I can't remember yet. So the first one was David Crosby giving Joanie all the props that she so rightly deserves. And the second one was Neil Young and I'm sorry we don't have more time because Neil kind of goes on in that interview and makes a similar statement as David Crosby that in his mind Joanie could very well be the best if not the best rock and roll performer if just not musical performer. he ever had the opportunity to see. And he was very proud to tell the story that one of the first times he met Joni, he played for her Sugar Mountain. Now Sugar Mountain at the time was a very meaningful song for Neil because he was 20 or 21 years old. So Sugar Mountain is the story of a place where pre-20s could gather and hang out. But once you crossed that bridge, you were no longer part of the group. And so Sugar Mountain is one of my favorite Neil Young songs. But he says he wrote it and that she was so impressed by it that it inspired her to sit down and write Circle Game. So whether that's true or not, who knows? But Neil Young is a great storyteller and mentioned that as well. But there's no doubt that they all kind of come from the same pool and the same talent and they all live together in Los Angeles in the late 60s and early 70s. And the influences of them on one another. are noticeable at every step of the way, but you know, years later, it's just, it's, it's so funny and interesting to hear these guys talk about her that way.
Judy Teibloom-Mishkin:
And to add to round it out, in the New York Times article of the 50th anniversary of Blue, which was two years ago, Graham Nash is interviewed and he talks about, she left, they were together, they were living together and she went to Europe to deepen her music and went on a journey. And she sort of left him at that point, but it was a little bit up in the air. And then he talked in that article about getting a telegram from her that he knew meant she was breaking up with him. And though he loved the song, Carrie. or whatever the title, you know, but Carrie, get out your cane. He, it hurt, it hurt because that was her next boyfriend after him.
Larry:
Well, that's hysterical because the David Crosby's interview that we're playing, the original premise of the interview was he was telling the story about how he and Joni were dating. The whole Crosby still has a Nash team. There you go. He and Joni were dating and you know, things in the relationship he thought maybe were, you know, getting a little rough, but you know, it was Joni Mitchell and he was very happy. And they went over to someone's house one night as they would with large groups of people, just all sit around and play tunes. And it w when it was Joni's turn. She picked up the guitar and she started singing a song. And he said, wow, this was a new song. Here's Joni testing out a new song for us. We all think this is so cool. And then he said, as I heard the lyrics, I realized she was breaking up with me. And she had written a song and she was playing the song in front of this room full of people telling me that she was breaking up with me. So he said, they all loved the song. And as much as I thought I loved it, I later on realized that maybe it wasn't the best song for me, but. You know, she, she certainly has a talent like that. And what I find fascinating is that, you know, she writes the songs to break up with the people. And yet, you know, here we are a number of years later and Taylor Swift, who just sold out three shows and many could argue is the next Joni Mitchell. Uh, she writes all of her songs about her ex-boyfriend. So, you know, there, there's a real common theme there that really seems to resonate and work well in that world. And, uh, and good for them, you know, it's, uh, it's just good stuff all the way around like that. Um, Judy, you had never been to the gorge before. What did you think of the gorge?
Judy Teibloom-Mishkin:
always on my bucket list. I always wanted to go to that venue as a person who loves live music. It is magnificently beautiful. And as a Midwestern gal, it reminds me a little bit of Alpine Valley, only in the sense that you've got that pavilion and the lawn, but also that it's country roads. The access in and out is tough. It's not off a main road. Their traffic flow could be a little better, but it was just magnificently beautiful.
Larry:
Well, both of you, Andy and Judy, you guys have been to Red Rocks, you've been to the Greek theater, I mean, you've been to some of the really special venues in rock and roll. And I know that The Gorge is always highly talked of, not so much by the Deadheads, I don't think the Dead ever made it there, but certainly the Fishheads, because it's been a mainstay of every fish tour on the West Coast forever. But Andy, for you, how does it compare to seeing a show at a place like Red Rocks?
Andy:
Um, what stands out about the gorge as opposed to probably any other venue is that there's nothing else nearby. So when you're looking out at the Columbia River rolling by and all of the, you know, the formations of the rocks around it, you're not seeing any city lights at all. You're really out there and it's just you and the gorge. And that creates a whole different experience of. being able to just focus on the music and not be distracted by anything. And it is really beautiful. I have one more Graham Nash story to tell you,
Larry:
Please.
Andy:
which was when I saw him do it like a singer-songwriter forum a few years ago in Berkeley, and he told a story about how when he and Joanie were together, they had gone to the LA farmers market, and when they came back to the house that they were sharing at the time, She said to him, I'm just going to go put these flowers in a vase. And he sat in the front yard and wrote our house after she said that to him.
Larry:
So I love this. These guys are inspiring each other's songs. I mean, they're, they're all right in the middle of all of this. This is a, so, you know, it's great. She's a performer and she's amused, right? All at the same time. And, uh, you know, I don't know how many people sat down on the lawn with Jerry and then want to write a song about him, but, um, certainly I can see, uh, these guys writing songs about her or inspired by her. And that's a wonderful thing. Okay. So Uh, you know, now the tough questions of the day for each of you will start with Judy. What was your high point of the weekend?
Judy Teibloom-Mishkin:
Well, my favorite Joni song, Beyond a Shadow of a Doubt, was A Case of You. I just, I don't, that's just my very, very favorite song. I could hear it thousands of times. I'll never tire of that song. That was, and the way she, her voice came in on that song, her and Brandi, and the way they played off each other. That was gorgeous. Although I don't know if that was the absolute high point. The whole thing, I mean the whole gestalt of it, of just being there with the beauty and with all the, there was such so much love in the crowd. Being there with three women I really love. We were a nice little community of our own. That's a tough question. Andy?
Larry:
Andy.
Andy:
I agree. I think it's a tough question and I think the whole night was so special but the very end turned into a massive sing-along with the whole crowd being able to sing along to both sides now in the circle game. And then she, I thought that was it. And it was so emotional, everybody was sort of sobbing. And then she came back and said to Brandy she wanted to do one more song and it was a Frank Sinatra song, Young and Young. heart and that
Larry:
Oh.
Andy:
was a beautiful bookend I thought
Larry:
for sure.
Andy:
and plus we needed to catch our breath because we were all sobbing.
Larry:
So, you know, there was many a time when we'd be seeing the Grateful Dead and, you know, they'd be having a really strong night. And when the show was over, you know, we just kind of be in this, I'm not going anywhere. I'm not moving yet. I know everybody else is getting up and walking out, you know, but I'm just not ready. You know, and I have thoughts of us doing that at the Greek theater and other places where, you know, you're just not ready to leave the room. I imagine there must've been a lot of that on Saturday night when the show ended.
Andy:
I think there was.
Judy Teibloom-Mishkin:
For sure.
Andy:
Go ahead, Judy.
Judy Teibloom-Mishkin:
I was gonna say, and it took hours to get out of there. I don't think anybody wanted to leave. And it was, yeah, everybody was moving in a daze.
Larry:
Yeah. Well, that's when you need our good friend, Larry Van Oaker, who somehow or other always knows to get behind a car and get the hell out of a crowded parking lot really quick. Um, but on the other hand, you know, then you're, then your focus shifts to traffic and not to the music. But I know when I spoke to you later that night, you were still flying. So, uh, it, you know, very, uh, very inspirational all the way around. It's, uh, it's great stuff and it's a great story. I'm so excited that you guys got to go. And. You know, Andy, I just have to say it's not so uncommon for Judy to necessarily run out and catch a hot show when I'm not there, but for Andy Greenberg to see a show and Alex Wellens not to be there. Those of us that keep score of such things certainly took note of that and I would say that you have a story for the ages that will certainly equal or top any story that our good friend Alex may come back to you with down the road.
Andy:
probably true. He had been at Red Rocks the week before with Max seeing JRad. So he had that over me, but also he may have been a tiny bit bitter that he wasn't invited to this.
Larry:
Well, he and I did talk a little bit about that, the guys being left at home. But we just came to the conclusion that this was a girls night and we've had plenty of ours so time for you guys to have one of yours. And now we all have great memories that we can share without stepping on each other's toes because they're so varied. We always kind of felt, I think, in our group that if one person got to see a great show then it was kind of like everybody got to because you knew the person that did. And you get to hear about it and you really get a lot of that. And yeah, so that's great. And yes, of course I have to give Alex credit because he easily made up in his mind by getting to go run to Red Rocks and to see JRad. And I know you guys have a whole summer in Colorado and Red Rocks and other good stuff coming up. So at the end of the day, Alex always gets his, I know. But I love that Max was there and for our listeners, we are good friends with the Greenbergs Wellens' and we just, in fact. had an opportunity to visit with their son Jake, who in the true Greenberg musical tradition was driving across the country to Michigan for the Electric Forest where his younger brother Max is on the production team and going out there. And I hope, Andy, that you've been getting good reports from them so far.
Andy:
Excellent report so far. In fact, Max sent me pictures from early this morning where he was asked to be part of the team that got to go up in the hot air balloon. So he's got good
Larry:
Wow.
Andy:
perspective. He was blown away by it. And I haven't heard anything about the music yet. I've just seen a few pictures from the forest itself. It looks amazing. Someday we
Larry:
So
Andy:
should all
Larry:
he
Andy:
go.
Larry:
hasn't yet been invited up on stage to play saxophone, but the weekend isn't over.
Andy:
Yeah.
Larry:
For those of you who don't know, Maxwell is quite the saxophone player and has played with the likes of Carl Denson and other musical legends, so that is not a talent to be taken lightly. Well guys, thank you. This has just been fantastic to get to hear all of this and far better than our usual just sitting around talking about the Grateful Dead and marijuana, which is a lot of fun to do. but to have an opportunity to really hear firsthand about such an amazing musical performance that probably at the end of the year, we'll look back on it and call it the musical high point of the year. And in fact, it may be the musical high point for a lot of people for the next however many years, before you get another opportunity to really do that. One last question, was there any talk or mention of Joanie touring or doing any other shows, or is it your impression this maybe was just a one-off?
Andy:
like to hope that she is going to be strong enough to do maybe a small tour or play other shows around LA where she lives but there was no talk about it yet.
Judy Teibloom-Mishkin:
But I think she really enjoyed it and I wouldn't be surprised if there was something else coming down the road. You never know.
Larry:
Well, I guess if Brandy has her way, this is far from finished. So we'll all keep our fingers crossed. And Alex and I may yet get a chance to experience this, although we will recognize that it won't be the magical moment at the gorge when it all came together. And we'll be chasing those memories as best as we can. Just veering back to our Grateful Dead show of the day, which by now almost seems kind of banal to talk about but that's okay. You know, it is the Deadhead Show and I know there are people who are listening to catch their fix of the dead. So this is actually a very, very nice tune to come on the heels of this discussion. You know, Stella Blue is always a great song, and I just love these earlier versions of it in the 70s. Again, when Jerry actually has a singing voice that's pleasant to listen to and plays the guitar with such purpose and really laser focused in on it. And I like to drop that in. We didn't really have a lot of time today to dive into this show, but as always, I would recommend. people dig it out and listen to it on archive or wherever you go to get your live music. It has a second set that starts with playing into St. Stephen, into the wheel and back into playing, which is just an amazing string, it should not be missed. And then in typical dead fashion, they immediately follow it up with a Samson Crazyfingers Stella Blue Jam. And from top to bottom, it's a great show. The auditorium theater was a great place to see them. They obviously like to be there. That's a great thing. But still, as beautiful and as wonderful as that Stella Blue is, I don't know. Today's all about Joni and we'll give the dead their due because they certainly deserve it and that's what keeps me going at least. But it's hard, I think, to really swing back to that when you've been in the presence of such a legendary person and in such a... uh... special and unique way and who knows you know maybe uh... had jerry lived you know we would have been seeing you know some new young rocker take him out on stage you know one of the guys from goose or something and try to do the same with him but uh... we won't get to do that with him we did get to do it with joanie and hopefully uh... we'll keep getting to do it uh... a lot in the future as we go forward uh... we did not have time to get any real marijuana stories today and i'm sorry about that but uh... certainly I think under the circumstances our listeners will understand. But there is one quick little story that I want to throw out. It's not a marijuana story, but this caught my eye the other day and I think that it just speaks volumes as to where we're at with a lot of these issues that we've been talking about lately. All-star NFL quarterback Aaron Rodgers, who's been in the news forever because of the trade from Green Bay to the New York Jets that was written about for months before it finally happened but we couldn't get him out. uh... erin rogers took three or four days of total self-isolation to kind of think things through and after all of that he's coming back now and uh... all the sudden he has become a very strong and vocal advocate for the legalization of psychedelics and he discussed his own experiences with it at uh... recently a multidisciplinary association for psychedelic studies uh... the largest u.s. advocacy group took place in colorado Colorado and Oregon have voted to decriminalize psychedelic mushrooms and psilocybin. While it's a sign of growing cultural acceptance for something that proponents say offers benefits for things like post-traumatic stress disorder, alcoholism and stuff, medical experts are cautioning that more research is still needed. But Rogers, he's mainstream. Yes, he went to Berkeley and who knows what he did back in the day. But you know, when you're the quarterback for the Green Bay Packers, that's about as middle America as you can get and as traditional values as you can get. And the fact that he's talking about it and his experience was specifically with IA Huska, which I have to say I'm not very familiar with and have never had a chance to have an experience with, so I can't speak off of that directly. But certainly he thought that it was. something that was good. In fact, he said it was ironic that the things that actually expand your mind are illegal and the things that keep you in the lower chakras and dumb you down have been legal for centuries, which I guess is just a nice way of saying that alcohol is legal and all this other stuff isn't. Another thing we've talked about, but the beauty of this, I think, for those of us who look at these substances and determine whether or not they have a part in our life. When you start getting football players, and we know how the NFL is, we saw all of the stuff with football players kneeling
Andy:
Thank
Larry:
for
Andy:
you.
Larry:
the national anthem and how that became the end of society as we know it, a guy like Aaron Rodgers is willing to step up and publicly acknowledge that not just that these are things in which he engages, but the benefits that he gets from them. We talked about this with marijuana before, right after the raw Stothat column, talking about how marijuana was going to be the death of us all and really it has no medicinal value. And my response is tell that to all the football players who have shown up at all of these conferences over the years and talk about all the tremendous benefits that they had from taking themselves off of opiates and other hard drugs and replacing it with marijuana and then try to say that there's no real value. So it's just wonderful to see Aaron sitting out and talking about this and a little more mainstream is always a good thing. Well that is our show today everyone. Thank you so much for tuning in. Thank you so much to Andy Greenberg and my wife, Judy T. Bloom-Mishkin, for taking the time to join us and share all of their wonderful stories. They are the lucky few and we are the lucky group that knows the lucky few and therefore, gets to hear all of the great stories. So thanks again, guys. We really appreciate you coming on. Andy, I'm sure we'll have reasons to talk to you again in the future, we always do. Judy, you and I will be talking about this every night for a long time. So it's great and just thank you both so much for taking the time to be on the show today.
Judy Teibloom-Mishkin:
It was fun to be a part of it.
Larry:
Absolutely.
Andy:
Thank you for having us.
Larry:
My pleasure, my pleasure. So for everyone, again, thank you for listening. Thank you for learning more about Joni Mitchell and the legend that she is. We will be back next week with more Grateful Dead music, more marijuana discussion, and all sorts of guests, although I can't promise you that they will have stories as inspiring as this one. So on our way out the door, we're going to hear one final song from this wonderful 1976 show at the Auditorium Theater. Kind of a standard Bobby tune, but it was Saturday night. So the song is not unexpected and then he didn't use it as his encore but he came back with another strong US blues and That's always a great way to walk out of a dead show that you've been having a lot of fun at So thank you all so much for listening. Have a great week. Stay safe and enjoy your cannabis responsibly