"Uni Dome Bliss: Jerry's Guitar Magic Illuminating Iowa Nights" Larry Mishkin discusses a Grateful Dead concert from February 5, 1978, held at the Uni Dome at the University of Northern Iowa in Cedar Falls. He emphasizes the exceptional performance, particularly focusing on the Scarlet Begonias and Fire on the Mountain combo, which he compares favorably to the renowned Barton Hall show from May 1977. Larry praises the guitar work of Jerry Garcia and highlights the unique qualities of this less-discussed but outstanding 1978 show. Additionally, he briefly touches on recent music news, including the Dead and Company's residency at The Sphere in Las Vegas and the upcoming Days Between event at Jazz Fest in New Orleans, featuring Government Mule and other legendary musicians.
"Uni Dome Bliss: Jerry's Guitar Magic Illuminating Iowa Nights"
Larry Mishkin discusses a Grateful Dead concert from February 5, 1978, held at the Uni Dome at the University of Northern Iowa in Cedar Falls. He emphasizes the exceptional performance, particularly focusing on the Scarlet Begonias and Fire on the Mountain combo, which he compares favorably to the renowned Barton Hall show from May 1977. Larry praises the guitar work of Jerry Garcia and highlights the unique qualities of this less-discussed but outstanding 1978 show. Additionally, he briefly touches on recent music news, including the Dead and Company's residency at The Sphere in Las Vegas and the upcoming Days Between event at Jazz Fest in New Orleans, featuring Government Mule and other legendary musicians.
February 5, 1978 (46 years ago)
Uni-Dome
University of Northern Iowa
Cedar Falls, Iowa
Show Title: The Dead Warm Up A Cold Iowa Night in 1978. Dead & Co scheduled to play the Shere. Alcohol v. Cannabis v. Tobacco – You already know the answer to this one!
INTRO: Bertha
Track #1
3:24 – 5:13
Great Jerry solo
SHOW No. 1: Samson & Delilah
Track # 12
1:30 – 3:10
Bobby’s mic not working so they have to improvise and keep jamming
Played 365 times, often on Sunday – “It being Sunday . . . “
First played June 3, 1976 Paramount Theater in Portland, OR
Last played July 9, 1995 at Soldier Field, Chicago
SHOW No. 2: Scarlet Begonias
Track #14
3:20 – 5:10
One of the best ever, great jamming
SHOW No. 3: Fire On The Mountain
Track # 15
7:15 – 9:02
Again, one of the best ever (and one of Rob’s favorites!). No lyrics here, just Jerry jamming away
SHOW No. 4: The Other One
Track # 18
6:10 – 7:40
Loud, solid, Phil!!!
OUTRO: Around & Around
Track #20
3:58 – 5:35
Not always everyone’s favorite, but this is a ripping version, they change the tempo on a dime and rock it out to end the second set.
"Around and Around" is a 1958 rock song written and first recorded by Chuck Berry. It originally appeared under the name "Around & Around" as the B-side to the single "Johnny B. Goode".
Covered by:
Rolling Stones - The Rolling Stones covered the song on their EP, Five by Five and second U.S. album 12 X 5 in 1964. Besides the band members it featured Ian Stewart on piano. In October 1964, they performed the song as part of their first appearance on The Ed Sullivan Show. They played it on a regular basis on their tours in 1964 and 1965. In 1964 the Stones opened their famed TAMI Show with the song. After more than a decade they performed the song again at the Knebworth Fair on August 21, 1976. It was also included on the 1977 live album Love You Live, from the El Mocambo club gig in Toronto. After that, it has only been performed occasionally, most recently during the band's 2012 U.S. tour at Prudential Center in Newark, New Jersey on December 15
David Bowie - English musician David Bowie recorded the song in 1971, produced by Ken Scott, under the title "Round and Round". Originally slated for inclusion on his 1972 album The Rise and Fall of Ziggy Stardust and the Spiders from Mars, it was ousted by "Starman" at the last minute.[4] Regarding the song, Bowie stated in 1972: "It would have been the kind of number that Ziggy would have done onstage...He jammed it for old times' sake in the studio, and our enthusiasm for it probably waned after we heard it a few times. We replaced it with a thing called 'Starman'. I don't think it's any great loss, really.
The Animals
Eric Burden
Pearl Jam
Meat Loaf
.38 Special
Maureen Tucker (Velvet Underground)
The Germs (American punk rock band
Guided By Voices
And more . . . . . . .
Dead played it 418 times, very high up in the overall song rankings.
First played: Nov. 8, 1970, Capitol Theater, Port Chester, NY
Last played: July 6, 1995, Riverport Amphitheatre, Maryland Heights (St. Louis), MO
Larry (00:06.478)
Okay?
Larry (00:32.81)
Hey, everyone. This is Larry Mishkin of Mishkin Law in Chicago, coming to you with another episode of the Deadhead Cannabis Show. Today is February 5, 2024, and we are featuring a little known but awesome show. We touched on it a year or so ago.
get into that in a minute, but this is a show from February 5th, 1978, 46 years ago today, at the Uni Dome, that's the University of Northern Iowa, in Cedar Falls, Iowa.
and it was a typical cold night in the Midwest and the dead showed up in Iowa and great things went down and by the end of the evening, everybody had worked up a good sweat and was having some fun, so much so this is out as Dick's Picks, I believe number 18, but let's get right into the opening tune here and check out the first track we got.
Mediaboard_sounds (01:40.051)
Thanks for watching!
Mediaboard_sounds (02:23.031)
you
Mediaboard_sounds (02:41.782)
Oh, that's all right, all right
Mediaboard_sounds (02:50.403)
Just jump on me Test me, test me Why don't you rest?
Larry (03:17.782)
yeah you know start off the show with a killer birth is always great way to go we've talked about that before for sure ever sold grateful that play and what i loved about this person really this is like uh... roadmap for this entire show that we're gonna be featuring here tonight from forty six years ago lovely cedar falls iowa jerry's on fire his guitar playing is just
and the rest of the band keeps up with him just fine and does their job as well, including Phil, who will highlight on a track a little bit later in the show. But Jerry's just having an on night. The vocals are nice. I wouldn't say there's anything necessarily special about them, otherwise he sings them fairly strongly, doesn't screw up too many of the words along the way, which is always a good thing for him. But he's just smoking on the guitar and...
just filling up the space so nicely and just stretching things out. An amazing night for that. This show's always been a little bit under the radar, I think, both in terms of when it first came out on Dix Pixar. I remember there was a lot of talk about what are we doing featuring a show from the middle of Iowa in 1978.
But when you listen to it and you hear the tunes, it's amazing. And now, of course, with the advent of Archive.org, you can bring down the entire show. And it's really, really not just a good example of the Grateful Dead in 1978, which it is, not just a good example of the Grateful Dead in the second half of the 1970s, which it is, not just a great show in terms of the Grateful Dead during any particular era, just a great Grateful Dead show. This one is top flight.
Rob and I discovered, rediscovered this show from the Unidome because it's the second part of a two-parter on DixPix 18 and
Larry (05:14.254)
There's a lot of great stuff. Rob really fell in love with it because of the Scarlet Fire, which we're going to get to shortly. But I just love it all now that I've listened to the entire show from start to finish. And from Chicago, Cedar Falls is just not really that far away. And too bad this was in 1978, not 2024, because otherwise we'd be right there with the boys in the lovely Unidome up in the South.
Cedar Falls and pretty much I think about the middle of the state really in terms of any direction it's not right on the Illinois border it's not really on anybody's border it's just kind of sitting there and you know God love the Grateful Dead they play there a few times not in Cedar Falls not necessarily at the Unidome but
This night that's where they were and they kick it off with a great bertha with Jerry just rocking his solo Now the next two we're gonna play is Samson and Delilah, but this is really funny and very interesting Because the intro goes on and on and on and on and on and I was very surprised at how long the intro went on And on and on and on and when I checked it out What we learn is that as they step up to play and they get to the point after the introduction Where it's time to start singing the song and this is primarily a Bobby tune His microphones not working
So they have to improvise and they have to swing back out and keep going around and playing. So I got the latter part of the intro into what should be the beginning of the vocals. And if you know the song, you'll know right when you're there. If you don't know the song that well, go listen to it live a couple of times and then come back and listen to it here and you'll know what I'm talking about. And then just hear Jerry kind of just run with it a little bit and watching out for his little buddy and all of a sudden they finally get it figured out.
you know, Bobby's beautiful voice comes booming through the microphone. So let's listen to this from the Unidome in Northern Iowa 46 years ago today.
Mediaboard_sounds (07:10.891)
you
Larry (08:50.542)
So you can look at it one of two ways, either you're disappointed a little bit here because you know.
We all love Bobby's tune, ready for him to hop in. On the other hand, Jerry and the boys just get to keep jamming, jamming. Now, don't be fooled by that little singing right at the very beginning, like Dan and I were all of a sudden. That was a very common way for them to start the song at that point. Jerry and Donna and Bobby would step up to the microphone and do that initial little, if I had my way, bit and then they'd go into the opening jam. But obviously, Bobby's voice is not there.
Larry (09:27.172)
his voice doesn't join in at all so rather than singing the tune which maybe he could maybe he could who knows Jerry you know back in 78 I'm liking to think maybe he could but nevertheless he just you know takes off with it and the rest of the band picks up the intro doing that is too long for us to just run it as a continuous clip till they finally start singing but they do get there eventually
And again, if you can download the show and listen to it, you can really get a chance to just hear the way they really play themselves into this tune and how cool it is just because it's a...
Larry (10:03.798)
a song that they really loved. And you can tell just by the numbers, right? 365 times, first played on June 3rd, 1976 at the Paramount Theater in Portland, Oregon. Last played on July 9th, 1995 at Soldier Field in Chicago. Often, often, often times played on Sunday. Bobby would step up to the microphone and lead it off by saying, it bein' Sunday. And then boom, they dive right into it with the drummers really crankin' it out at the very beginning of the more 1980s and 90s style
But either way it's a great tune and of course that day, this day, February 5th, 1978 was in fact a Sunday. So no surprise that the Grateful Dead were playing Samson and Delilah on that day. Good Bible tune on a Bible day in a Bible town, right in the middle of Bible country of the United States. But not too Bible that the Grateful Dead couldn't come in and do their thing and really just have some fun with the folks in Iowa. And it's a great show.
comes away from it really happy. We'll go back to the show in a minute. We've got a little bit of music news going on here that I want to get to. This is probably.
the biggest news in the Grateful Dead world in a little bit of time, but in the, who had the over-under on how long it was gonna take for them to announce that no, they're really not done playing against that company, they're coming back. Well, all it takes is for some hotel or group of hotels or whoever the hell did it in Las Vegas to build a fancy, schmancy venue like The Sphere, which we all heard about a few weeks back, thanks to good buddy and friend of the show, Alex Wellens. And then we talked about the fact that Fish is doing a four-nighter there, although the tickets were absolutely impossible to get.
And now, this past week, the debting company announced that they are going to do a residency there. It was originally billed as like a seven to eight week residency, but I think that demand for tickets was so great that it's already been extended out into early July possibly, starting sometime in mid-May. It was going to go from mid-May to the beginning of June, but they've really stretched it out. The demand was huge for it. And of course, on the one hand you say, of course it is, on the other hand you say, really?
Larry (12:14.584)
But why not, right? I mean, it is Dead and Company, and we've all talked about that. John Mayer's a great guitar player, does an admirable job filling in for Jerry, except for the fact that he's not Jerry. So it all depends again, what you're going to see these guys for. And I've seen my share of Dead and Co. shows, and I've had a good time with them. They're really a lot of fun, but it's gonna still be that band playing in a very cool theater. And to me, there is a pull there, because of course, the Grateful Dead have always been kind of cutting edge in terms of technology, and their light shows back
beginning in the mid 1980s and then moving forward, we're just really cutting edge for what bands were doing at the time.
handled and organized by guys who Were very well trained in the art and you know long time members of the Grateful Dead So, you know just like a good sound mixer They knew where the band was going they knew how to have the lights Rocking and roaring and you know bringing the crowd to their feet and Blinding you with the white light when they sing sometimes the lights just shining on me and trucking and all of that kind of stuff Fish does a great job with it too. And quite frankly, we'll get a little taste of what a good rock and roll band can do With that venue. I'm sorry. I don't mean to diss you
when I said that what I should have said is a jam band coming out with you know all of the stuff that they always do. I've heard and Alex told us that the U2 backgrounds were magnificent in their own right and I have no doubt that Bono and the boys rocked it hard but you know this is a little bit different and you know for those of us who are deadheads on the one hand.
You know, it's kind of a cool thought. On the other hand, the tickets are really freaking expensive. And that's where I ultimately am. My group all kind of made the decision that we're not just going to knuckle down right now and start shelling out whatever you needed to shell out this week.
Larry (14:05.018)
to get a package with two nights in a hotel and a night at the show and I don't know, $2,000 or something like that, maybe more, which maybe in the scheme of things isn't the worst amount of money in the world, but it's still a heck of a lot of money, I think, for most people. And I'd really like to see the Sphere, but I think I'd like to see the Sphere with a band that I feel is really peaking and more at the top of their game than playing to
you know, kind of keep the flame going. And I don't mean any disrespected dead in company when I say that. I think that they are a very good band and I've voiced my opinion on that on this show often.
But at those kind of prices, I think you just have to kind of take a step back and decide, you know, whether that's a bus you can afford to step onto or not. And hats off and all my love to the folks that get there and make it there and support them. And I'm still not saying I'm not going to go. You know, I'm just saying that I'm going to have to take a wait and see attitude with this. And, you know, somehow things always have a way of working out. So maybe even if it's a last minute workout and figure out a way to get out there now that they've added more shows to at least see one of them, if not two.
and have a little fun in the dome with, you know, the Grateful Dead related night, which those of us who have seen the dead in Vegas and just those of us who have seen the dead can certainly appreciate and have a lot of fun with, even if we don't have Jerry up on stage singing, and who knows, maybe they'll have some, you know, 3D, you know, avatar image of Jerry. I, it's Las Vegas, I would put nothing past them, but this is gonna be big, it's gonna be amazing, it's gonna be fun.
of the Grateful Dead three nights a week, Thursday, Friday, Saturday, for a bunch of weeks. I think they're taking Memorial Day weekend off and maybe a couple of others along the way.
Larry (15:57.854)
But otherwise, they're going to be in residency at the Sphere in Las Vegas for a while. And even if you're in Las Vegas and you can't afford the shows, you don't want to go to the shows, you don't have time to go to the shows, just go by the Sphere because the outside light show will be just as amazing with all the dead logos flashing all over it and all sorts of other cool stuff that I'm sure will really be fun and very cool to see. So the grateful dad doing a residency at the Sphere.
in Las Vegas and why not. Hats off to them. Our next story in the world of music is something that's really, I think, starting to gain some serious traction now. The people who are into these things will tell you now this gained traction a long time ago. But more mainstream traction, I think, where people are really beginning to focus in on it. And what I'm talking about is the days between.
And this days between is not the days between during the first week in August when we're commemorating the days between the birth and the death of, uh, Jerry Garcia, August 1st and August 9th.
in their respective years. This is the day's D-A-Z-E between that has now become an official part of Jazz Fest in New Orleans. Jazz Fest has traditionally always gone down on the last weekend in April and the first weekend in May. And there's a week in between. And since not everybody can afford to be down there for all that time and even the folks who can't say, well, not that New Orleans isn't an amazing town and great place to be,
But if I've just been there for Jazz Fest and seen a whole weekend of music, do I really want to stick around? Well, now you have a good reason to, because the days between has gone from kind of being an informal thing to now a very formal part of the whole experience. And this year it's going down on Tuesday, April 30th, Wednesday, May 1st, which is the week in between the two Jazz Fest weekends. So if you're down there and you're inclined to stick around, or if you live down there,
Larry (18:03.114)
You know, you've got the bug after the first weekend and you're not ready to stop booking it, sitting around waiting for the next weekend to come around and really by Thursday, May 2nd, it'll all kick off again. So.
You're gonna have to Jones it out through Monday, April 29th, and if you can do that, then more power to you, you've made it. But a really impressive lineup has been put together for both days, and certainly something that makes it worthwhile if you're a music lover and a fan of jam band music, a fan of improvisational music, a fan of New Orleans style music, and rock with Southern roots, and all that kind of stuff,
through this weekend, not weekend, but days between week, line up on Tuesday, April 30th, you're gonna have Lettuce with John Scofield sitting in, and that's probably worth your price of admission right there. Lettuce is a very, very creative jam or performance band or whatever you wanna call them.
that have really kind of made their way into the whole scene on the Grateful Dead jam band side of the world. They've got some great people playing with them, including Eric Krasna, who's a founding member. But bringing John Scofield in is a real nice touch. John Scofield is an amazing, amazing guitarist. Really plays a number of different string-like, guitar-like instruments. And he does things on his own. He does things with other groups.
And we're going to talk more about him in a second. But John Schofield is really, really.
Larry (19:48.222)
just a great addition to Lettuce and I think that if you're there on that Tuesday and you have a chance to go see them you will be thoroughly impressed and enjoy it very much. Also sharing the stages that night they have two stages set up for both nights for the days between and I imagine you just bopping back and forth as one band finishes and they set up that stage for the next group you run over to the other side where it should hopefully be all set up for you and ready to go. But in addition to Lettuce with John
band playing and they're always a lot of fun. Now you have the Carasno Moore project playing which again is Eric Carasno with
Mr. Moore from Galactic, Steven Moore, I believe is his name. And they are a really, really cool group of musicians who get together and just really jam out and have a great time doing it. They're both kind of eclectic, Stanton Moore, excuse me. They're both very eclectic and really bring it all together. Stanton, as I say, was the...
drummer for the band, still is a drummer for the band Galactica, founding member. And Eric Krasno has been around on the jam scene for a long, long time. He's done some, uh, stuff with the guys from, uh, the dead from time to time. A lot of his own stuff, other, other jazz band, jam bands out there. And, uh, they're, they're
conglomeration the Cresno More project. We'll also be playing that Night Dogs in a Pile, one of the newer bands on the jam band scene. Cool cool who I can't you have to be honest with you I can't tell you a lot about. And the Rumblers featuring Chief Joseph Boudreaux Jr. which I'm going to imagine is much more of a New Orleans scene kind of thing so your friends from New Orleans
Larry (21:37.73)
can probably fill you in on that very nicely. Probably Rob Hunt could fill you in on that. Alex Wellens could fill you in on that. I cannot, though, but I'm sure if you go online and Google it, you'll find out all you need to know about Chief Joseph and the Rumblers. So that's already a great night, right? If you're down there for the first weekend and you've made it through the first Thursday through Sunday, maybe it starts Friday through Sunday, you've taken Monday night off just because you need a night to recuperate.
uh... every single night in a row for god's sakes how young do we think we are uh... and then tuesday rolls around and there you are out there doing your thing with that without light up and you'd be forgiven i think for saying although man i'm taking wednesday night off that's a little too much just thursday the second weekend of jazz fest kicks in and one of those that you got the rolling stones plants i mean we're talking big stuff going down there but when you hear the light up for wednesday may first it's kinda hard to say you're not gonna go because
Little Miss a lot, right? The feature band that night is gonna be Government Mule. So when we say Government Mule, right, that's Warren Haynes' band, and we say, that right there is already great. Those guys are awesome, they come out, they just crank it out, they jam. He's a southern boy, so he gets the whole feel for what's going on down at Jazz Fest. And that would be great, but that's not it. Joining them.
is a cast of legends, one and all, John Scofield, who we just talked about. And John Scofield has a history of playing with government mule. And when he does, it is a conglomeration affectionately known as Sco Mule, which is just them playing the.
government mule songs with John joining in and they really connect I think Warren and John and great things happen when they do that. Also playing with government mule that night will be Chuck Lavelle, a keyboardist of Allman Brothers and Rolling Stones fame and a guy who's really left his mark on the industry. Very very talented and be exciting to see him sit in with the government mule team. Ivan Devil who's a New Orleans legend and speaks for himself. Carl Denson
Larry (23:48.464)
Also a legend from that part of the world. And we've talked about Carl Denson and his band, Tiny Universe and how awesome they are. And he'll get him up on stage with his saxophone. The Dirty Dozen Brass Band is gonna join. And Daniel Donato, so it's gonna be government mule and a cast of many. Who the heck knows what they're gonna play or what they're gonna do, but it's gonna sound awesome. Very, very exciting stuff. So that right there, yes, is a great reason to roll over and make sure that you're there on Wednesday, May 1st.
that's not enough. You're gonna also get a set from Galactic with Jelly Joseph. You're gonna get a set from Carl Denson's Tiny Universe, so we just got done talking about Carl, and we've talked about Carl's band, Tiny Universe. Absolutely one of my favorite bands to see out there these days, just great musicians playing great tunes, and they just really do a tremendous job. Daniel Donato's Cosmic Country is gonna play, Karina Reichman, who I have to confess I don't know a whole lot about,
calling themselves the Iceman Special, which I know absolutely nothing about, but the people who go to days between will find all about this great music for us and let us know. I believe my good friends John and Marnie are going to be down there, Rick and Ben, and a lot of their big crew, folks down in New Orleans just out to have a good time and listen to some great music. And if you live down there, this is why you do. This is exactly why you live in New Orleans. Yes, Marnie Graz is great. There's no question about it.
Larry (25:17.844)
celebrations that they have in the New Orleans area is very cool. But Jazz Fest is just such a special unique thing. You know, we like to call it Lollapalooza for adults. The type of food that they offer is just a step up from the regular fare that they offer over at Lollapalooza and festivals of that like.
you're in new orleans and they've got all these tremendous late night shows going on and now the days between they bring the rolling stones and just one real legendary band after another uh... and if you go if you're gonna get to be there uh... good for you that's gonna be a great thing i do not think that i will get to uh...
Jazz Fest this year. I have been down there before and hope to be there again, but we're going to so many shows this year it's hard to keep up with all of them and make sure that we still have time to be able to get everywhere. So, working on it, we'll see what happens. Now we're going to go back 46 years to the Unidome and we're going to really get to the heart and soul of this concert and one of the reasons why for so many people it's the very quiet, you know, kind of not...
Not as much talked about, but certainly favorite 1978 show for so many deadheads as we roll right into some Scarlet Pagonius here.
Mediaboard_sounds (26:51.934)
Thanks for watching!
Mediaboard_sounds (28:10.37)
Smile, what a devil, a person just for you Strangers stopping strangers just to shake their head Everybody's praying in the heart of golden veil
Larry (28:29.154)
So this Scarlet Begonia is in the Fire in the Mountain, which is about to follow, because you can't have one without the other. Just takes the show to a whole other level. And let's listen to the clip we have from Fire.
Mediaboard_sounds (28:40.38)
Some call it marry-
Mediaboard_sounds (28:52.787)
you
Larry (30:31.382)
so yes fire on the mountain just uh... another incredible versions and uh... to say rob discovered it uh... about a year ago while doing a whole scarlet fire and um... just absolutely uh... outstanding and this fire has about it five or six minute introduction after it flips over from the scarlet into the fire uh... before jerry even start singing
Larry (30:59.246)
10 minutes, and this is a 16 minute version of it, and it's just hot all the way through. That guitar playing was so good that I couldn't find a way to get in the best licks and some of the lyrics, so the lyrics had to go because the licks were just too great. And what a great show to be at. What an absolutely solid way to come out and open a second set and really just get this going right in front of everybody and have things really moving. And
just a wonderful one-two combination, the Scarlet Fire, always, and in this case really in particular I think it just really stands up very well over the test of time. You know it's interesting because for many people that the gold standard for Scarlet Fire is the 5877 short Barton Hall.
in Ithaca, New York. And of course, really, when you're sitting here looking at this show, this show is not even a full year later. That was in May of 77. This is in February of 78, so about 3 quarters of a year later, still a few months to go before the first anniversary of Barton Hall. And I would argue that this Scarlet Fire is really right up there with the one from Barton Hall. And maybe if this show had the Barton Hall morning due tacked on to the end of it, people might be talking about this being
Grateful Dead shows ever. But certainly it gets a lot of talk. It's the top show of 1978, one of the top shows of that period. And again, The Scarlet Fire seems to be in everybody's top five, or most peoples that I was seeing online when I was going through and checking out what people had to say about this show. And the songs in general. So really no surprise it would be those tunes. And really no surprise that The Dead come out one night
Larry (32:46.384)
tour and really throw down. The trick is finding those shows and being able to identify them. And of course, big thanks to Dick Lovatla, the former dead archivist before his untimely passing. It's now David Lemieux. But Dick got the whole thing started with Dick's picks. And for people like me, it was such an eye-opening thing because it was a chance to really get an opportunity to explore.
all you know so many different errors of the grateful dead uh... but now we know instead of you know i had so many issues on tape but you know the truth is by comparison the quality on many of them uh... just you know didn't match up uh... and it's you know it's nice to be able to buy these and to have all of the shows and you know one by one uh... to kind of get introduced to such a good range of concerts because
You know, again, not to slam Iowa or anything, but, you know, whenever there's a show, you know, anywhere in California, everybody's curious what the hell do they play. You know, if they're doing a show up in Brendan Byrne Arena, you know, people will be on the cell phone, on the cell phones or in the hallways on the pay phones back in those days, you know, calling all their buddies, oh my God, they, you know, they just played this or they just played that. But, um...
You know, sometimes flyover country, especially places like Northern Iowa, uh, you know, tend to get overlooked by the, the big East coast and West coast heads. Um, and again, you know, sometimes those are the very best nights to be there to see the boys and whether they do it just because they figure what the heck, you know, we'll show you, we'll, we'll throw down a great show in the middle of nowhere, whether that's just the night they're feeling it the best. I can't tell you, but I can tell you this, um,
that it's a wonderful second set, it's a wonderful show all the way around.
Larry (34:35.278)
uh... and you know rob hund knows what he's talking about when he talks about how much he likes it so i highly recommend it uh... even if you just want to go to youtube and just pull down the scarlet fire combination uh... from this show uh... i think you'll really enjoy that maybe that's a good way to kind of lead you into the entirety of the show uh... if the rest of the clips that we're going to play here in a few minutes don't do it but we'll find out however now is the time flip over to
the other topics we talk about on this show, and that's primarily the world of marijuana. And Dan, what is our intro music today?
Mediaboard_sounds (35:13.025)
Some call it marijuana, marijuana Some of them call it ganja, ganja Never mind, you have to legalize it And don't criticize it
Yeah, yeah.
Larry (35:46.494)
Well, that is our good friend Peter Tosh, who recorded this song way, way back in 1976.
48 years ago. And, you know, couldn't play the whole thing for you, unfortunately, but he goes on to sing about how singers smoke it and players of instruments too, legalize it, yeah, that's the best thing you can do. Doctors smoke it, nurses smoke it, judges smoke it, even lawyers too, amen. So you've got to legalize it and don't criticize it, legalize it, and I will advertise it, it's good for the flu, it's good for asthma, good for tuberculosis, even umara composites.
Birds eat it, ants love it, foals eat it, goats love to play with it. So he just goes on and on. And as always, Dan has found us a great tune to feature as we head into the marijuana side of things. So thank you, Dan, for that. And thank you, Peter Tosh, for doing your thing. So we've got some interesting stories here to talk about today. The first one I want to go to, though, is one of the types of stories that I think just keeps coming out.
we love to see. And actually, this story is from this past summer. But that's recent enough for it. And I found this story thanks to our good friends at WGN.
Larry (37:08.818)
one of the oldest and biggest stations around Chicago and parts of the country. And, uh, there's certainly on top of things and it's nice to see them getting involved in reporting on cannabis, but not just cannabis news studies too. So, uh, WGN recently wrote that in nearly half of the United States, alcohol, cannabis, and tobacco are all legal for those over 21.
However, the three substances come with different rules, taxes, and of course, health effects. So questions were posed to doctors around the country. How do alcohol, marijuana, and cigarettes rank when it comes to your health?
All three doctors agreed on which is best. Now they had some conclusions, some conditions that, stuff like it's difficult to conclusively rank them in order of risks, as there's been no major randomized control had to have trials among the substances. We get that. The amount you consume of each substance also greatly impacts your risks or bad effects. Another doctor pointed out that each individual has their own risk factors based on family history, pre-existing conditions and more.
But when it comes to generalizing for the average person, they said that alcohol was the worst, followed by tobacco. Alcohol use is linked to over 200 health conditions and diseases damaging every organ system in the body. Depression, anxiety, dementia, cancer, heart, and liver disease and bone disease can all result from alcohol consumption. Similarly, tobacco use is largely connected to serious cancers, chronic obstructive pulmonary disease, and cardiovascular disease.
Another one said I would certainly rank alcohol as number one. I'm going to say that alcohol in moderation is okay, but too much alcohol is going to have an impact on many illnesses.
Larry (38:55.626)
They talk about how the harms of tobacco could be largely reversed when people stop smoking earlier in life. If people understand the risks of lung cancer based on how many years you've been smoking and how much you've been smoking, if you stop at an early age, your lungs can reinvigorate and get back to normal. But one of the other doctors disagreed and ranked tobacco worse due to the fact that it actually has no proven health benefits. He said, tobacco, I would argue, is the worst substance of the three. It has no conceivable benefit, even in light amounts and considerable risks.
to increases in heart disease, cancers, and premature mortality, among others. Alcohol, on the other hand, could have benefits at light or moderate amounts, but then risks come on with larger amounts. Talking about red wine in particular, having antioxidants, and pointing to studies that up to one glass a day can reduce inflammation in blood vessels. But here's the good part. All three doctors and others who they spoke with agreed on which ranked least harmful.
to the average person's health. I would put marijuana as the least harmful, one said, mainly because we know that there's a lot of medicinal use for marijuana, and used in the right format in the controlled environment is fine.
Chemotherapy patients often credit cannabis as the only thing keeping their appetites up, allowing them to get their nutritional needs. Another doctor said evaluating cannabis healthfulness and harmfulness is more complicated than the other two. The available evidence suggests that cannabis could be of benefit when medically supervised as part of a treatment plan for certain conditions such as chronic pain, anxiety, trauma, insomnia, and muscular disorders. But he went on to say that cannabis use could make certain mental health issues worse as well as impair memory
concentration. Said the data suggests there is an extra risk to young adults whose brains aren't fully developed, which we've talked about and acknowledged on this show.
Larry (40:47.922)
Plus, one of the doctors noted the U.S. Department of Agriculture and Health and Human Services have guidelines on how much alcohol adults can consume in moderation, up to two drinks a day for men, one drink for women. There are no such guidelines for safe cannabis or tobacco use. I think negative health consequences could be possible for all of the three substances, even in moderate amounts, depending on the person and situation. There's no foolproof vice. All three of the experts emphasize each person is unique. You should always talk to your doctor about your specific situation.
All very true, but cannot help us get away from the fact in the underlying conclusion that there is no hesitancy on anyone's part to say that marijuana is the least harmful of tobacco and alcohol. Why is this important? Because as we as a society grapple with various substances that we're going to allow to be sold to citizens, we have to be careful not to overreact and not to...
inflate risks or falsely equate risks from one substance with another substance while we give the most harmful substances passes all day long.
and those substances are alcohol and tobacco. And any town that says we don't want marijuana in our town but allows tobacco to be sold and or allows alcohol to be sold has to go take a good long look in the mirror and say why are we doing this? Why are we supporting substances that provide higher health risks and a greater mortality rate than marijuana? Which in its straight form of just smoking marijuana right now currently the medical sciences knowledge has a zero mortality rate. And yes, like anything else, if you smoke too much marijuana
or if you're that one or two people out of whatever large number who happen to have a negative experience with marijuana, that sucks. But we have that with everything. There's some people who can't smoke. There's some people who can't drink. Right?
Larry (42:39.818)
alcoholics exist in this world. We don't say we can't have alcohol as a legal substance because of alcoholics. So we can't say that we can't have marijuana in this world because some people, who appear to be a very, very small number, suffer from what they're calling marijuana personality disorder, marijuana use disorder, marijuana whatever type of disorder.
they want to call and talk about it. It's just something I think we all have to be very, very careful about. Now, another problem that has faced the legalization of marijuana, and we've also talked about is, how do we run this balance between saying, we don't want people who are high on marijuana, who are still under the effects of having smoked marijuana, operating motor vehicles?
uh... this show is always consistently advocated uh... that smoking and uh... marijuana and driving go to bed should not be going together anymore than alcohol and driving should be going together uh... nobody uh... ever advocates for intoxicated driving the point that's made over and over and over again is that if you're going to choose between advice if people are going to go out we're going to accept society
that people on a Saturday night, on a Friday night, on a Thursday night, whatever night, are gonna go out and they're gonna go to a bar or they're gonna go to dinner and maybe have a couple of glasses of wine, maybe mix that with a drink, maybe just have a couple of drinks. Or the alternative is that somebody's gonna go out on one of those nights and go to a consumption lounge or go to a friend's house or go somewhere where it's legal to smoke marijuana and smoke. And both of them are gonna get in their cars and drive home and that's just the way it is. The question is,
people drink and drive or would we rather have people smoke and drive? Meaning are we better off trying to get people who drink to change over to smoking marijuana? And then we say well but now they're gonna be driving home high but we say yes but statistically it's gonna be safer than driving home drunk.
Larry (44:48.35)
And that's just the way it is. We've talked about all the reasons and all the studies that find that to be a fact. I don't think there's really much debate when it comes to that, and there shouldn't be. We've all know people who are very drunk and get behind the wheel of a car, and we know how terrifying it can potentially be. And we also know what it's like to get behind the car with somebody behind the wheel of a car who's very high. And just.
I don't mean to laugh at it, but there the problems are that they tend to be driving very slow and maybe a little overly cautious, which unfortunately can be just as dangerous and just as potentially hazardous to other drivers on the road, but you just don't see the same I'm gonna go get him and tear him up type of rage, if you will, that you see with people who get really liquored up and then hop behind the wheel of a car and ready to go take off. So the problem though,
is that there are some people who will get really, really high and then go drive. And how do we come up with a way, if we pull somebody over for erratic driving, and we suspect.
that they might be high and we test them and it comes back and they find THC in the blood. We know that that's not a good indicator of anything, right? Because depending on the volume that you typically smoke, the marijuana will remain, the THC will remain in your bloodstream and will show up positive on tests for anywhere from 14 to 30 days and maybe even longer. But that doesn't mean that you've been getting high every one of those days.
And if you get high on a Sunday night, and the following Saturday you're in an auto accident, and they test you and they come back and find THC in your blood, they're gonna wanna say, oh, you've smoked under the influence of marijuana, this is gonna be an enhancer of the punishment, and we're gonna bring a stronger charge against you, a DUI charge.
Larry (46:42.314)
And I say, what the hell are you talking about? This is Saturday. I haven't smoked marijuana for the last six days. I'm not high. I'm not driving under the influence of anything. Right, this is just your testing for something that we know doesn't leave the body for a period of time. So we've always been going back and forth. How do we do it? There is a blood test that can be drawn.
the test metabolites, but that's much more of an invasive type of test ultimately, and more of an expensive test. But now we have, thanks to Marijuana Moment here, scientists saying that they've identified an alternative way to test for recent marijuana use that's significantly more accurate than standard THC blood tests that sometimes misrepresent a person's potential impairment depending on how frequently they use cannabis.
They're working actively to build on that research with an extended study. The initial study, which was funded in part by the National Institute on Drug Abuse and published in the journal Clinical Toxicology, could have key criminal justice implications as police currently rely on basic THC blood tests for evidence of possible intoxication in criminal investigations, such as after car accidents. But as the researchers from the University of Colorado point out, that testing standard can be unreliable, especially for frequent
cannabis users. As we just mentioned, since THC accumulates in leers in fat tissues, daily cannabis users may maintain constant elevation of THC in the blood even long after the psychoactive effects abate. Colorado, University of Colorado said in a news release.
A more accurate method of testing for recent marijuana use, they found, is by analyzing the molar metabolite ratio of THC to THC-COOH in the blood. If a person's ratio of the active and inactive metabolites meets or exceeds a 0.18 cutoff, you can feel pretty confident, 98 percent certainty, that the person just used marijuana within the last 30 minutes. They tested this approach by having 24 occasional and 32 daily marijuana consumers participate
Larry (48:53.328)
in a driving simulator exercise. Participants had their blood analyzed at a baseline and then 30 minutes after a 15 minute smoking interval. The study revealed that the molar metabolite rate of THC to THC-COOH at a 0.18 cutoff yielded results with 98% specificity, meaning there was a 2% false positive rate, 93% sensitivity, meaning the test only fails to detect recent use 7% of the time, and 96% accuracy,
By comparison, testing for THC alone yielded 88% specificity, 73% sensitivity, and 80% accuracy. So the principle here is that you're looking for active drug use versus inactive drug use. Because THC and hydroxy-THC are active and carboxy-THC is inactive. So it makes sense that soon after you smoke cannabis, you're going to have relatively more of the active form present.
Larry (49:53.168)
decreases, the more likely that the act of form present, the tail end of residual or smoking occurred many hours ago rather than indicative of currently being under the impact or under the effect of marijuana. So this is important. This is a very, very key thing because not only is this gonna have implications in the world of driving,
but it's gonna have implications in the world of employment. And finally, this should put an end.
to the really draconian employment policies that so many employers continue to use, which is if you test positive for THC, you're gone. Again, regardless of how stupid that is, because it's not a measure of whether you are currently impaired while you are on the job. And now that an employer can actually test, oh, you came up positive for THC, but oh, when we use this other test, we find, no, you probably have not consumed in a long enough
Larry (50:58.424)
coming into work right now. So of course this then raises the question of whether employers are gonna care if their employees are getting high at night off of work time, because even if you smoke a joint in the evening and then go to bed, by the time you wake up in the morning, the metabolites are very much on the carboxy side rather than the hydroxy side, meaning that the THC is basically completely inactive, meaning that you're not impaired in any way and probably less impaired than somebody
the night before and pounded down who knows how many gin and tonics or you know bourbons or you know scotches or tequilas or whatever you know you're drinking these days. And you know now we will allow, this will allow marijuana users to compete on a level playing field.
If in fact employers are willing to use it and use it in a good faith way, if they come in predisposed to get rid of anybody who smokes marijuana, well, then it's not going to be that hard and you can do that. But what you're going to find is you're missing out on a lot of quality people and that using marijuana is something to make a determination about a person's worth, both in general or as a potential employer, as a potential student, as a potential partner, as a potential anything, just really isn't a very accurate way to go.
predisposed prejudice that is unfortunate in this day and age, especially with the more advanced thinking times we're living in where states have said, we're not going to send a runaway for the federal government. We all know it's absurd to think that marijuana belongs on schedule one. So the heck with that, we're just going to go ahead and
this is what we're going to do. And it's a problem, it really, really is, but this is nice to know that while we still fight this other battle, people cannot continue either intentionally or unintentionally to prejudice against cannabis people by trying to make up things that aren't true by suggesting that simply just because you test positive for THC means that your actions were impaired at any one particular time after the THC metabolites
Larry (53:10.512)
converted from a hydroxy state to a carboxy state. And that's a good thing. And now we have a group of Democratic senators that are calling on the DEA to deschedule marijuana entirely and it's about damn time. They say that the recommendation to reschedule the drug to schedule three does not go far enough to reduce harm that has occurred from the current system. In a letter addressed to Attorney General Merrick Garland and DEA Administrator Ann Milgram, 11 Democratic senators,
of Bernie Sanders, an independent officially from Vermont, argued the administration should de-schedule marijuana altogether. Marijuana's placement in the Controlled Substance Act has had a devastating impact on our communities and is increasingly out of step with state law and public opinion. If marijuana is rescheduled, it will be legalized.
Larry (54:02.542)
The question is to what extent would it then become legalized on a nationwide basis? Because if they're going to do it from schedule one to schedule three, then you may have more states that might decide that they're going to do it. The DEA is still conducting a review of the Health and Human Services, of the recommendations from the Department of Health and Human Services that it should be rescheduled to a schedule three. Lawmakers have cited recent disclosure documents in which Health and Human Services acknowledged
likely does not meet the criteria to be considered schedule one. They also point out that nearly half of all states in the US have legalized recreational marijuana since the last time the drug scheduling was considered way back in 2016. Of course it doesn't meet the criteria to be schedule one. Everybody knows that. If the DEA and Health and Human Services doesn't want to just come out and admit it, it's because they're embarrassed that for so many years they've been saying that it does somehow demonstrate that it belongs on that list, which is just absolutely
stupid on every level and we're not gonna swing back into this. So you know this is where we wind up in a situation where
Larry (55:16.574)
It's important to understand the differences between rescheduling and de-scheduling. And we've talked about that. Either one of them gives you relief from 280e. Either one of them gives you banking services, but only one of them continues to say with no basis to say it that marijuana is illegal if not properly used under the terms of its scheduling spot on the controlled substances act. And we've talked about what that means of its schedule three and the fact that
Every other scheduled 3 drug in the country is sold only by pharmacists, only with doctor prescriptions. So, you know, I don't know what that means for marijuana, and nobody else does either. If it's descheduled, we don't have to worry about any of that. We just move right past it.
Why wouldn't we? We just saw a study that's coming out that's telling us that as between marijuana, tobacco, and alcohol, two of them are sold legally with no restrictions other than age restrictions and some use restrictions. But otherwise, you're not gonna get arrested for possessing alcohol. You're not gonna get arrested for purchasing alcohol. If you're a licensed seller, you're not gonna get arrested for selling alcohol.
Everybody just accepts it as a way of life, even though it kills so many, such a much larger percentage of people than marijuana ever could. But this is the world that we live in. It's one step at a time. I'm happy with the steps we've taken up to this point.
Now it's just a matter of really moving things forward and keeping them going and staying away from places like Texas that's recently initiated legal proceedings against marijuana decriminalization in five cities in Texas. Of course, no surprise given that the Attorney General is Ken Paxton, who based on the charges that have been brought against him does not shake out as one of the...
Larry (57:10.602)
better people you want to be an attorney general in your state in my opinion only in my opinion uh... and it's not a surprise that mister paxton uh... and probably governor greg abator behind this have decided that even though local municipalities have decided that they want to decriminalize marijuana and allow it to move forward uh... they here in the state are not going to do it we're talking about austin of course and marcos keline elgin and dentin
decriminalized marijuana.
Paxson argues that the cities have adopted policies that contradict Texas laws on marijuana possession and distribution. He emphasized the need to enforce drug laws uniformly across the state, if only that were true, just go ask our friends in the inner city and other places why people arrested are disproportionately black or Hispanic or some other recognized minority. So all of a sudden, Paxson is on his high horse arguing to us about all sorts of things that are all high and mighty after he was impeached for a number
And you know, you can't just go around and play the public issue card while you're being charged for bad acts in the rest of your official policies. And that's what he's doing here. He's saying part of this is based on health concerns, linking marijuana to increased risks of psychosis and schizophrenia. He referenced studies to support his claim, and of course he did because they all do until we go and we look at the studies.
Larry (58:43.888)
of their evidence and people are willing to come forward typically show that they relieve chronic pain, they help with substance abuse problems, it helps people get off of opioids, it helps people get off of psychotropic drugs. There's just so many positives. You know, to suggest, well, I can find one negative that's been popularly spoken about, schizophrenia, but.
i just don't see where the numbers bear it out i don't have any personal experiences with it many of my friends or anybody i know who's ever smoked marijuana uh... becoming schizophrenic certainly not with the frequency of people who smoke marijuana get lung cancer so you know you can't just come up with way out there arguments don't really mean anything science is a whole i think is look past that understands of the way this works we just have to get the government on board with us
And it's a battle, folks. And we've got guys like Ken Paxton who don't really care about the truth and don't really care about anything, but they know a good issue when they see one, and he's banging the drum very, very loudly. And we're going to start banging the drum loudly and pivot away from marijuana and back to the show that the Grateful Dead is playing from the Unidome in the University of Northern Iowa 46 years ago today. And let's dive into a really, really solid version of the other one.
Mediaboard_sounds (01:00:57.777)
The bus stopped in his place So I'm running, I got on, let's win it all again There was cow money, the light, the wheel, the bus, too, never ever land Howie,
Larry (01:01:32.65)
yeah that's just your guitar playing is as they go flying through that song jerry still at their all feel it fills ever present in the background there uh... drop in the base bombs keeping the baseline going all the way through it uh... bobby sing in the great lyrics uh... cowboy neil at the wheel it's a great it's a great image it's a great thought uh... and uh... you know for those of us that have wrote a little bit more on
Larry (01:02:00.13)
you know, Cassidy's role in all of that and Ken Kesey and just really good stuff, the electrocoulate acid test we've talked about as just being a great chronicle of that period of time when all of this was going down in the mid to beginning of the second half of the 1960s.
and all the acid tests, we featured music from the acid tests, which were a big thing, and really helped solidify the dead as one of the leaders, if not the leader, in the psychedelic jam band movement at that time, and really positioned them to be able to move forward. And uh...
develop the other side of them the Americana side and the bluegrass side and the countryside and By 1978 we're just getting incredible shows and this one is no different So we're gonna head out here And when we do we're gonna take you out on around and around which It's not always everyone's favorite and what I mean by that is it's not one of those tunes or it comes home says oh wow man They played around and around tonight It's a
It's a very good tune though, and some nights they play it stronger than others. Sometimes it's... I've almost always seen it as either the final song of the second set or leading in as a bridge from the song out of space into the final song of the set. And it's a Chuck Berry tune. You know, I think that it's always a fun tune, and this is just a really ripping version. What you'll hear in a minute when we go out is how they're playing it at one tempo,
different tempo and take the song to a whole other level. And what a great way to really get the crowd fired up and moving and really doing their thing. The song was written and recorded by Chuck Berry in 1958. It was on the B side to the single Johnny B. Good, maybe one of the greatest rock and roll songs of all time. The Rolling Stones have covered it. It was on their album 5x5 and on their second US album 12x5 in 1964.
Larry (01:04:05.38)
that featured Ian Stewart on piano in October 1964. They performed it on the Ed Sullivan show. They played it on a regular basis on their tours in 64 and 65.
After more than a decade, they performed the song again at the Nebworth Festival on August 21st, 1976. It was included on the 1977 live album, Love You Live, by the way. An unsung, amazing, amazing live album. It may not quite be Get Your Yah-Yahs Out, but it's just an amazing live album. It captures the Rolling Stones, you know, at their fiercest in the mid-1970s, and I highly recommend it. So it was on Love You Live.
at the Al Macombo Club during a gig in Toronto on that tour. And after that it was only performed occasionally by them, most recently during the band's 2012 tour at Prudential Center in Newark, New Jersey back on December 15th of that year. The song was also covered by David Bowie. It was recorded in 1971, reduced by Ken Scott under the title Round and Round. It was originally insulated for inclusion on his 1972 album, The Rise and Fall of Ziggy
Larry (01:05:17.228)
and the Spiders from Mars. At the last minute, it was ousted for the song Starman regarding the song, but we stated in 72, it would have been kind of a number that Ziggy would have done on stage. He jammed it for old times' sake in the studio and our enthusiasm for it probably waned after we heard it a few more times. We replaced it with a thing called Starman. I don't think it's any great loss really, which is kind of harsh for David Bowie to say. First of all, Starman's a great tune and absolutely belongs on the Ziggy Stardust album.
If there was no other room on there for a round and a round, okay, you know, play it some other time. But it is a great tune. It is a lot of fun. And, you know, Bowie's got to do his thing. It's also been covered by The Animals, by Eric Burden, separately from The Animals. It's been covered by Pearl Jam. It's been covered by Meat Loaf, by 38 Special, by Maureen Tucker of Velvet Underground fame, by The Germs, an American punk rock band from back in the day, guided by Voices, and any number of others.
The Dead wound up playing it well over 400 times, a very high up in the overall song ratings, first played on November 8th, 1970 at the Capitol Theatre in Port Chester, New York, last played on July 6th, 1995 at the Riverborne Amphitheater in Maryland Heights, St. Louis, Missouri. As we head out, I've got two birthdays coming up this week that I want to give shout outs to, one is to my wonderful son, Johnny Skins, and the other is to one of the greatest women in the world I've had the pleasure to know, and that's the Genie Genie.
from up Wisconsin Way. Happy birthday to both of you, you're both great people, very important in my life, and love to hang out and party with all of you all the time, and hopefully we will going forward. So thank you for listening today and joining in with us once again. We love listener comments, we've been getting a few here and there. Dan sends them over to me, we try to respond and let people know that if you're listening to us and taking the time to speak, that we're gonna listen to you and speak back. We do have some interviews
up with some of our friends and people who are very well connected into the industry and as soon as we can find some free time for them we're going to have them on as well. But in the meantime, fear not, we've got many, many Grateful Dead tunes, Grateful Dead shows to feature and to talk about. Lots of great stuff going on in live music and all good things cannabis. So thank you as always. Have a great week. Be safe and enjoy your cannabis responsibly. Enjoy this final tune.